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One, or rather two, of the significant experiences of my life, have been two intimate friendships, in different times and places, with two male-to-female transsexuals. I don't actually want to talk about them; I featured one of them in my fic Second Chance, and I have reasons not to describe the other at all. Let me just say a couple of things. First, when I speak of an intimate friendship, I do not exaggerate. Both these persons told me everything, and I have a fairly clear understanding of their minds and experiences. Second, they were very unlike in many ways, so that having met the two of them counts as having acquaintance of a fairly broad spectrum of male-to-female TS/TG experience.

One question that has since occurred to me is the historical status of this particular sexual identity. Homosexuality of both genders is known to every culture; and bisexuality, though it has only felt the need to define itself as an identity in our time, is at least a recognizable phenomenon down the ages. On the other hand, while individual cases are on record in many times and places, I think it would be very difficult to compile a dossier of recognized categories and groupings in history that would add up to anything recognizable as the modern category of transsexuality and transgendering. Certainly eunuchism and castrato status do not count, both because the condition was not in general willingly embraced by the victim, and because eunuchs and castrati were recognized and treated as males. The issue was disability, not gender identity. So far as I can see, the fourth term of the hallowed quaternion GLBT is the only one that seems to represent something genuinely new.

Of course, the fact that a category has only been recently recognized does not mean that it did not exist before. There are a few possible reasons why it may have not been recognized as a standard category of sexual deviation. It might be that, before modern times, there were too few in earlier societies to form a coherent and recognized group. People often don't recognize the significance to modern socity of the sheer weight of numbers: people often speak as though an England of three million inhabitants (Queen Elizabeth's time) posed no different administrative, social and political problems than one of forty-seven million (today's). That is the main flaw of nostalgia as a program. Specifically, the formation of groups of recognized sexual difference - sexual difference not as an occasional feature, but as a regular social phenomenon - does not tend to take place until the rise of large cities. Therefore, if we suppose that TS/TG people are even fewer than homosexuals as compared to total population, it may be that it took them even longer to realize that they existed - as a group - at all.

Another possibility is that the whole group might exist as a result of an advance in surgery - the invention of gender reassignment therapy, which, unless I'm mistaken, took place in the fifties. A cynical hypothesis might suggest that this was, like the near-contemporary discovery of laser, "a solution without a problem", but that its existence taught people who were, in whatever way, unhappy with themselves, to look for a way out by "changing sex".

Another possibility is grimmer. My experience of TS is that they are constantly close to suicide. I had to fight to keep both my friends going; the possibility of self-destruction was always in their minds, seductive as a siren. And if you think about it, it makes sense. To reject one's own physical body is pretty close to rejecting one's own physical existence. At any rate, one thing is certain: to be unhappy with one's gender is something that poisons your whole life - every second. It is a condition of regular and terrible unhappiness; it produced the most painful lives I ever met. Now, if TS as a group were not heard of until the invention of sex-change surgery, it may be that any person who, before that date, suffered from unhappiness with their gender, might simply commit suicide, and add to the number of unexplained tragedies that are a constant feature of any society. Not everyone would have any idea why a member of their family cut his/her throat or jumped into the river, and if they did, they would want to keep it quiet, for it would be the same, in the eyes of contemporary society, as to declare them insane. From this point of view, the invention of gender reassignment surgery "created" TS/TG as a group in a different sense: it gave them a reason to go on living.

Recently, however, I have become aware of a fourth possibility. Everyone who follows the news will by now be aware of the case of Bruce/Brenda/David Reimer. Baby Bruce Reimer was one of twins born to a young working-class couple in Canada. A few months after birth, a botched circumcision (an operation which is apparently almost universal in North America) left him without a penis. The devastated parents were taken to a supposed great authority in the field called John Money, and Dr.Money proposed a radical step: reassign the baby's gender and bring it up as a girl. As everyone knows by now, the results were catastrophic: Bruce, now Brenda, was unhappy his/her entire childhood, while Dr.Money heartlessly produced a string of publications falsely claiming the operation a success. Eventually his mendacity was exposed, but, in spite of successful gender reassignment therapy, Brenda, now David, was never happy, and recently committed suicide after the unexpected death of his twin.

This ghastly story has repercussions far beyond the tragedy of one man. The point was that Dr.Money, who was already a prestigious figure in his field when he started his experiment on Bruce/Brenda/David, was trying to validate a theory that he and many other people of his time believed passionately - that gender roles are purely social in origin. What the case of Bruce/Brenda was meant to prove - and, according to Dr.Money's publications, did prove - was that an early enough (and medically justified - let us not forget that the baby had effectively suffered a grave accident) intervention could allow sexual roles to be successfully altered. Dr.Money's papers were widely read, and large numbers of doctors believed them: and it led to what I am told is a regular practice in modern hospitals - to intervene on the sex of babies of doubtful sexuality, boys with overly small penises and girls with over-large clitorises, in the first few days after birth. According to what I read, this practice is widespread, regular, and, until recentently, unchallenged.

Hands up all those who knew that doctors regularly play God with the gender of new-born babies. I certainly did not.

Now there are features of Bruce/Brenda/David's story that resonate very strongly with my experience of my TS friends, especially the lovely creature I have cast as "Maria Pinto de Magalhaes" (not her real name, of course) in Second Chance(http://www.astronomytower.org/authors/fpbarbieri/SC.html), especially the way in which other children, long before puberty, recognized "Brenda" as something wholly different from themselves, and different in a specific, sexual manner. And if gender reassignment in early days is as common as I have heard, then a fourth, and awful, reason for the recent rise of TS/TG as a social group becomes possible: that it is an epidemic, and a medically induced epidemic at that.

Let us be clear about this. Hermaphrodites exist and have always existed. Every year, an extremely tiny number of babies are born with dubious, double, or no sex. What we are talking about, however, is both different and far broader in range. For even granting the existence of persons whose sexuality is naturally dubious, there is a choice open to every doctor: to leave things as they are, until and unless asked by the subject him/herself to alter them. What the practice of regular genital modification on new-born babies is about is not any properly medical problem: it is a belief, built largely on Dr.Money's papers (which were however, lest we forget, responding to a general consensus) that sexual identities are social constructs and that they can be manipulated, not just harmlessly, but to the positive advantage of the babies, in cases where physical sexuality is ambiguous or inadequate.

Considering the sheer horror of life as a TS/TG as I have seen at close quarters, well, if it turns out to be a medically inflicted error, all I can say is, God forgive us all. It would be interesting to make a study of known TS/TG and see if any correlation between their identity and early surgical intervention exists.

Better late than never

Date: 2004-10-26 07:23 pm (UTC)
From: (Anonymous)
I agree with you about the frequency of suicidal ideation among the transgendered, though I will add that I have been less frequently depressed myself since figuring out what was the matter with me. As with many psychological phenomena, there are individual differences.

I'm only f/m though. There are fewer social taboos against masculine females than feminine males, so in many cases, especially those of us who aren't 'out' in our everyday lives, the difficulties are a lot less significant. Obviously, however, that is a very subjective statement. Over the years, I have heard far more unpleasant stories (murders, beatings, rapes) involving m/f transgendered persons.

Given how unpleasant the lives of the m/f transgendered can be made by society, their families, friends, and so forth, I have no doubt that suicide might sometimes seem preferable to some of them. Not to mention the anxiety caused by dissatisfaction with one's own body.

It would be interesting to make a study of known TS/TG and see if any correlation between their identity and early surgical intervention exists.

I have only known a few people who are transgendered, and none of them well enough to speak to that specific question. However, in my case, this isn't so. I'm relatively normal. But I am also sure that there are many cases where early surgical intervention could have precipitated some difficulty with gender identity. I would like to think that it's rare.

Sometimes I just wish our families and our society would just let us be who we are. I think that would solve a lot of our problems.

Re: Better late than never

Date: 2004-10-27 12:57 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] fpb.livejournal.com
Before I reply to this, you would do me a favour if you told me if you are who I think you are.

Re: Better late than never

Date: 2004-10-27 12:30 pm (UTC)
From: (Anonymous)
If you think I'm Aeryn Alexander, you would be right; however, you may have many sworn enemies who are transgendered rage-addicts. Since none of the others replied, I thought I should.

Re: Better late than never

Date: 2004-10-27 01:00 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] fpb.livejournal.com
What I said was: I know only one transgendered LJer, who is a sworn enemy of mine. I meant, of course, you. Now I will deal with your points. Unfortunately, thanks to the Buttiglione affair, I am in a militant mood.

First, I cannot imagine what you mean by "better late than never". Some of my experience of TS/TG was published long ago in Second Chance, which was based almost entirely on my own time with a particular person (except I did not fall in love with her, since at the time I was - height of irony - already in love with a butch lesbian). The rest of this article is to do with the questions raised in my mind by the Bruce/Brenda/David affair, and specifically with the discovery (which I have only made in the last few days) that doctors routinely alter babies' sexual organs. In other words, the only thing that was in this article which you could not have found out about me long ago was one thing that I myself did not know until a few days past. If you had wasted less time looking for reasons to hate me, and more reading my fics, you might perhaps have saved us both some unpleasant experiences; and at any rate, if there is anyone here who should say "Better late than never," it is I, not you.

Over the years, I have heard far more unpleasant stories (murders, beatings, rapes) involving m/f transgendered persons.
I repeat: read my Second Chance. I may add that back in the jolly days in which you had such delightful fun describing me as some sort of mix of Himmler and Nurse Ratchet, I was particularly incensed by your reference to your gay friends. Well, I have had gay friends; I have seen one of them stagger home beaten to a pulp in a queerbashing attack; I have gone with them to the police, and testified for them in a magistrates' court, when someone was trying to get them evicted for no other reason than that they were a homosexual couple; and I have, more importantly still, put up with for years, and forgiven, the regular and sickening Friday-evening bouts of drunkenness of one of them. Why? Not because they were gay; in my view, that was at the heart of their unhappiness; but because they were my friends, not as gays, but as human beings. In ten years, I have cohabited with no less than three different gay couples, not to mention one of the two TS (the other, although equally close to me, lived in another city). Yes, I have had gay friends. Not all have been my friends: one of the male gay couples had very unpleasant features, and I was glad when they moved out. But I have had probably more close, even intimate, gay friends, than many of the people who started the howling against me. I do still, though it is getting harder, as the increase of anti-Christian intolerance is making it difficult to even suggest that there might be anything wrong about the lifestyle - and incidentally, demeans the persons by making them identify themselves with the lifestyle, by making them think of themselves,` not as people, but only as gays.

Re: Better late than never

Date: 2004-10-27 02:25 pm (UTC)
From: (Anonymous)
I cannot imagine what you mean by "better late than never".
Sorry. I was just referring to your disappointment that no one had replied to this post. Nothing deeper nor more substantial than that.

As for reading your fics, the first story of yours that I had ever heard of was "Gay Bar", and from it I got the feeling that you don't exactly write the sorts of things I normally read. It isn't exactly the best first impression. I'll just leave at that.

I was particularly incensed by your reference to your gay friends.

and

incidentally, demeans the persons by making them identify themselves with the lifestyle, by making them think of themselves,` not as people, but only as gays.

I've met a lot of my friends through activism, so I tend to identify them with the cause. In general, a person's identity is made up of the roles they occupy in society. For instance, a person may think of his/herself in terms of their occupation, their place in their family (mother, sister, daughter), their race, gender, sexual orientation, and many other things besides. In different contexts, different components may be more salient for both the person and those around them.

I don't think that being GLBT would cause a person so much unhappiness, not that it always does, if society were more accepting.

Re: Better late than never

Date: 2004-10-27 02:38 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] fpb.livejournal.com
Sorry, you are wrong. You not only read at least another fic of mine, you left a positive review. http://www.fictionalley.org/ficalley/reviews/showthread.php?s=2b04929efa29b00af8ebd5f6bb2997c0&threadid=27647 I'm afraid that hatred may have interfered with your memory.

Re: Better late than never

Date: 2004-10-27 03:10 pm (UTC)
From: (Anonymous)
I'm not sure if it was the hatred or the number of fics I've read since then.

second part of the answer

Date: 2004-10-27 01:00 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] fpb.livejournal.com
Given how unpleasant the lives of the m/f transgendered can be made by society, their families, friends, and so forth, I have no doubt that suicide might sometimes seem preferable to some of them. Not to mention the anxiety caused by dissatisfaction with one's own body.
In my view, this is upside down. It is because the TS I knew were dissatisfied (a very mild word for the hatred they both felt) with their own bodies, that anything society or their families did could wound them so much. Besides, at least one of them does not seem to have had any problems with the family, and that was the gloomier, if anything, of the two. What I think the cases of my friends, and of Bruce/Brenda/David, prove, is that the spectrum of sexual identity, though not entirely fixed, is certainly a natural fact, and that a radical uprooting from it is a source not only of permanent unhappiness but also of a violent need (the core of the TS identity, at least as I know it) to do anything to straighten it out.

I have only known a few people who are transgendered, and none of them well enough to speak to that specific question. However, in my case, this isn't so. I'm relatively normal. But I am also sure that there are many cases where early surgical intervention could have precipitated some difficulty with gender identity. I would like to think that it's rare.
As you are a psychology postgrad (or so I think), it would make a good research program for you in the future: on one hand, see whether my view that TS/TG is, as a social group/cultural identity/concept, a modern phenomenon, or whether essentially similar phenomena can be traced in other or earlier societies (I am a culture historian, but I admit that I have not made a full study of the matter, and that my opinions are just that - opinions); and on the other, see if there is any correspondence between TS/TG and early gender reassignment surgery. Surely it would be an important area to investigate.

Re: second part of the answer

Date: 2004-10-27 03:08 pm (UTC)
From: (Anonymous)
Besides, at least one of them does not seem to have had any problems with the family, and that was the gloomier, if anything, of the two.

In part, I'm very relieved to hear that, because I always hear about the bad family situations. However, it is very unfortunate that having a good family situation did not improve your friend's situation.

the spectrum of sexual identity, though not entirely fixed, is certainly a natural fact, and that a radical uprooting from it is a source not only of permanent unhappiness but also of a violent need (the core of the TS identity, at least as I know it) to do anything to straighten it out.

For the most part I agree with that. About one in 65,000 people are transgendered. Obviously, this isn't a huge number of people, and some are unhappier than others. So while traditional gender identity is certainly the norm, it is important to remember that there are those who, for whatever reason, deviate from this.

The need to fix the situation, whether through surgical means or just attempting to live one's life as the gender one feels is appropriate, does seem to be a constant.

it would make a good research program for you in the future

I have to admit that would be interesting, and I did think about applying to programs in Gender Studies. However, I'm too close to the subject to be objective. Science requires a lot of objectivity, and I don't have that. I don't think anyone who knows me would disagree there.

There have been studies done to try and determine the cause of what one of my older textbooks calls 'gender identity disorder' and numerous medical hypotheses have been suggested: hormonal imbalances in the mother during pregnancy, subtle neurological differences, and abnormalities in the production of sex hormones in adulthood. However, none of these hypotheses have received unequivocal support.

As for early gender reassignment surgery... there's a case report of a John/Joan Thiessen whose experience seems similar to your Bruce/Brenda/David.

Re: second part of the answer

Date: 2004-10-27 03:29 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] fpb.livejournal.com
while traditional gender identity is certainly the norm, it is important to remember that there are those who, for whatever reason, deviate from this
I do not know whether we agree or not. What I am saying is that gender identity is not "traditional," but basic to human experience; and that that is shown by the fact that where a major problem exists, the instinct to correct it is not only immediate but seems to become a radical part of the identity of the person. In other words, I think that the existence of TS/TG persons actually goes to support the centrality of the sexual divide in human life. You can see where this agrees with my Christian faith, since the distinction between male and female is a major feature of Christian philosophical anthropology.
I'm too close to the subject to be objective. Science requires a lot of objectivity, and I don't have that
I disagree; or rather, I don't think it works like that. What you need to do good research is a passionate interest in your subject, which usually takes the form of a passionate admiration for a scholar or scholars. I do not think it is possible to set oneself the goal to be objective, because that sets up an infinite regression: "By golly! I am being objective! Yes, but how well can I measure my objectivity? And how can I be sure of the objectivity of my measurement?" etc. What happened to me was that as I grew experienced in my subject, I came to understand it not through the eyes of my mentor (the great French historian Georges Dumezil), but with my own, seeing things that he had not been able to see. I could practically point to you the page in my first published book where that happened. When I became conscious of that, I knew that I had reached my maturity as a researcher (and it was some time about my thirtieth year, so you've still got time).

Re: second part of the answer

Date: 2004-10-27 06:55 pm (UTC)
From: (Anonymous)
What I am saying is that gender identity is not "traditional," but basic to human experience

But obviously there are people whose physical sex and whose gender identity don't match. For some of them, the struggle to help their biological sex match who they really are is an unpleasant, sometimes painful necessity. So we do disagree in this respect, I think. While the basicness of the traditional gender identities (male vs female) may be true for an enormous majority of people, there will always be those for whom their biological sex is a poor fit.

What you need to do good research is a passionate interest in your subject

I'm sure that helps to a degree, but with some people and some subjects, this passion can be more hinderance that help.

I do not think it is possible to set oneself the goal to be objective

Probably not. However, might it be possible to recognize a lack of objectivity and steer one's self toward an area where that deficiency is less glaring?

Re: second part of the answer

Date: 2004-10-27 10:19 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] fpb.livejournal.com
Aren't we chasing our tails a bit here? To make matters clearer, here is what I deny: I deny that sexual identity is secondary, accessory, socially conditioned, rather than natural and innate. To be brutal (and I know that Kenna Hijja at least, and probably many more of my friends, will disagree) I say that girls play with dolls, and boys with toy pirate swords, because they are born that way. I admit a great deal of variation - that is why I spoke of a spectrum rather than of two fixed wholes - but I believe that this spectrum is fundamental. Given that, of course if a person experiences, in his/her being, a major disharmony, then that person will have, as part of his/her basic identity, an inherent drive towards a particular sexual identity. But gender, as such, is not socially conditioned but innate.

Probably not. However, might it be possible to recognize a lack of objectivity and steer one's self toward an area where that deficiency is less glaring?
It sounds to me like you are something like scared of picking up a subject area that will go too near the bone. My point of view however is that if a person like you has picked such a subject as psychology, there is likely to be a reason. However, if you just don't want to do it, forget it.
I hope you're not a Yankees or Cards fans. To all Red Sox fans: CONGRATULATIONS!!!

Re: second part of the answer

Date: 2004-10-28 11:40 am (UTC)
From: (Anonymous)
I deny that sexual identity is secondary, accessory, socially conditioned, rather than natural and innate.

Then this would be where we disagree. I don't think heterosexuality or holding one gender identity versus another is innate, though heterosexuality is very common. It is merely convenient for reproduction, which is no longer a high priority for many people, so there's no longer a need for people to hide who they are and adhere to the social expectation to have/father children.

I say that girls play with dolls, and boys with toy pirate swords, because they are born that way.

And I had a wooden sword my father made for me, because when I was little, I wanted to be a knight. I also had Legos, chemistry sets, and video games.

I don't think children pop out of the womb with a preference for one type of toy over another one. They play with the toys they are given. Eventually, they prefer that type of toy because it's familiar.

Given that, of course if a person experiences, in his/her being, a major disharmony, then that person will have, as part of his/her basic identity, an inherent drive towards a particular sexual identity.

Let me see if I understand that right. Only people who have experienced some sort of traumatic event can be transgendered?

My point of view however is that if a person like you has picked such a subject as psychology, there is likely to be a reason.

I originally went into psychology because I didn't have the marks (or ability) to major in pre-medicine, but thought a related field of study might help me get there. I eventually started to enjoy psychology.

Re: second part of the answer

Date: 2004-10-28 11:52 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] fpb.livejournal.com
There. That is what I wanted to know, and this is where we part company. I ask for this discussion to stop, since I know what I think and you have just stated (in a fairly dogmatic form, although I have no doubt that you could present it in a more nuanced way and defend it with some intelligence) a viewpoint that contradicts mine, though I am aware it is highly popular in American (and British) academia. I have no desire to go further, since we could only deepen our contradiction.

Only one thing: where did I speak of "traumatic events"? I do not believe in the importance of events. I find it easier to believe that a person may be born with a profound disconnection in his/her nature, as with distorted legs or (as sometimes happens) three or four breasts; but what matters is not the event, not even the origin, but the permanent condition that arises. I am no Freudian, to go explore the mysteries of my potty-training and the unconscious failures of my early food intake to justify the shape of my soul today.

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