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Four years ago, the government of the French Republic took the lead in refusing to support the Anglo-American invasion of Iraq. The French, who had taken a very active and successful part in the first Iraq war, simply did not think that an invasion followed by the occupation of an Arab country was a good idea. That was their prerogative (see under "sovereign state").
(My position was that I loathed Saddam Hussein so much that anyone who wanted to drive him out was fine by me. I would even have supported an Iranian invasion. But I would not have started to insult people who disagreed.)
The idiot part of the American right suddenly made France the bout of all their hatred. Someone spotted a market opportunity, as Americans do (the French do that as well, but when the French do it, that's evil!) and prostituted a certain amount of historical knowledge in the search for a quick buck, producing some sort of tract which rewrote history with the claim that "France have always been our enemy, but they have concealed it under a pretence of friendship".
I would dismiss this intellectually contemptible and factually fraudulent thesis in as many words, and not even bother about it, were it not that one of the finest minds in my f-list seems to have been taken in by it. As it is, I want to ask how you imagine you can trace a consistent attitude of hatred, and what is more, of subtly disguised hatred, in a nation that has, since the foundation of the United States, experienced three royalist constitutions, five republican ones, two bonapartist ones, and one fascist tyranny, and completely boxed the compass in terms of attitudes, views, and alliances. This is the kind of things that rabid anti-Semites postulate about Jews - attitudes consistent across the centuries, constant vicious subtlety in carrying them out, hatred fertile in invention but completely barren of reason. The French ought to be proud: they have been promoted to the rank of Chosen People, next to that other target of unreasoning, blind, stupid, despicable hatred. In case anyone had any doubts, I regard Jew-bashing as a stain on the face of mankind.
No doubt the prostitute or prostitutes who set out on this bit of free enterprise got out of it what they wanted - money, admiting letters from ignorami and fanatics, and the odd spot on TV talk shows; rewards that serious historians get rather less often. But as we are still free people here, I want to use my own freedom of expression, rather less despicably than the prostitute or prostitutes concerned: first, by calling whoredom by its proper name; and second, by stating clearly that there shall be no pity here for such views. The historical slag or slags who sold their integrity for popular success will not be treated as anything but filth, and anyone who takes them seriously is warned that I will do what is in my power to restore them to sanity.
(My position was that I loathed Saddam Hussein so much that anyone who wanted to drive him out was fine by me. I would even have supported an Iranian invasion. But I would not have started to insult people who disagreed.)
The idiot part of the American right suddenly made France the bout of all their hatred. Someone spotted a market opportunity, as Americans do (the French do that as well, but when the French do it, that's evil!) and prostituted a certain amount of historical knowledge in the search for a quick buck, producing some sort of tract which rewrote history with the claim that "France have always been our enemy, but they have concealed it under a pretence of friendship".
I would dismiss this intellectually contemptible and factually fraudulent thesis in as many words, and not even bother about it, were it not that one of the finest minds in my f-list seems to have been taken in by it. As it is, I want to ask how you imagine you can trace a consistent attitude of hatred, and what is more, of subtly disguised hatred, in a nation that has, since the foundation of the United States, experienced three royalist constitutions, five republican ones, two bonapartist ones, and one fascist tyranny, and completely boxed the compass in terms of attitudes, views, and alliances. This is the kind of things that rabid anti-Semites postulate about Jews - attitudes consistent across the centuries, constant vicious subtlety in carrying them out, hatred fertile in invention but completely barren of reason. The French ought to be proud: they have been promoted to the rank of Chosen People, next to that other target of unreasoning, blind, stupid, despicable hatred. In case anyone had any doubts, I regard Jew-bashing as a stain on the face of mankind.
No doubt the prostitute or prostitutes who set out on this bit of free enterprise got out of it what they wanted - money, admiting letters from ignorami and fanatics, and the odd spot on TV talk shows; rewards that serious historians get rather less often. But as we are still free people here, I want to use my own freedom of expression, rather less despicably than the prostitute or prostitutes concerned: first, by calling whoredom by its proper name; and second, by stating clearly that there shall be no pity here for such views. The historical slag or slags who sold their integrity for popular success will not be treated as anything but filth, and anyone who takes them seriously is warned that I will do what is in my power to restore them to sanity.
no subject
Date: 2007-04-17 05:44 pm (UTC)Ok, if you want to classify things like the rape epidemics as "terrorism" (which makes some sense) the solution is to come down hard, using the criminal system, on those who commit and also those who inspire those crimes. The rapists, etc. should be sentenced to maximum consecutive terms; the clerics should be prosecuted under ever "incitement" statute you can dig up; and any claims based on religion should be treated as aggravating rather than mitigating factors.
I do not, unfortunately, at present see much sign that the European Union countries are doing this. Instead they seem to be accepting "cultural" excuses as mitigating factors and trying to keep the crime wave secret to avoid Alarming the Populace.
And I know this is one aspect of the topic on which we are in agreement.
no subject
Date: 2007-04-17 06:13 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2007-04-18 05:26 pm (UTC)You wouldn't really have to "single them out" for special punishment though -- just stop singling them out for special tolerance. Treat aggressive madmen inciting violence and their dupes the same way that you would treat any such individuals, and don't let them plead the Koran as an excuse for their actions. Surely no one has special rights to kill, rape, assault or vandalize because of his faith, right?
The very fact that jails are swollen with Muslim prisoners hardly suggests that we do not take them seriously.
But for how long are you keeping them? Are you willing to go after the inciters and accessories, as well as the (duped) principals? And are you willing to expand your prisons if need be?
There is a lot at stake here. If the Muslims are allowed to build a shadow state alongside your own states, ruled by shari'a, then there will be no assimilation of the large Muslim immigrant populations, because those who try to assimilate will be forced off this path by the shadow state. And the creation of such a shadow state is an explicit aim of the radical Muslim clerics.
Futhermore, you are quite right that you should not abandon your own constitutional principles. But if the state, acting under these principles, fails to deal with the threat of a massive, violent unassimilated Muslim population attempting to force the rest of the population into dhimmitude, then the peoples of your countries will probably rise up, vote some sort of Fascist governments into office, and deal with the Muslims in a far less gentle fashion -- one likely to cause suffering to the innocent as well as the criminal.
And even that would be better than the Orson Scott Card future in which your lands become "Eurabia," your peoples living in servile fear, and your ancient cultures and traditions ruthlessly trampled by alien conquerors. Which is a very real possibility, if neither liberalism nor fascism finds a solution.