well, it's true that we do have two Sytherin adults (Snape and Regulus) who changed their mind after going with the Death Eaters. They still went, mind you and we know that Snape's reasons for turning back at least were not purely about right and wrong, which begs the question: if Lily had left the country for Switzerland at the beginning of war, would he have been happy to remain a Death Eater? But fair enough, let's admit that Snape and Regulus chose the side of light and thus prove that redemption is possible for Slytherins...
But having none of the Slytherin currently at Hogwarts join the side of Light? I mean precisely because they're only eleven when they're sorted, and also because they represent after all a full quarter of the school, you would expect that at least some of them (even just one) would, by the time they're 15, 16, 17, start thinking a little independently, especially once it has become clear lives were at stake.
"Sure, a handful will actually choose otherwise: but most won't even realise that there *is* a choice."
I totally agree with that, I think that's a realistic view: the majority follows and a handful acts differently. Except that in Canon, among the students of Harry's generation, there is not a single Slytherin joining the rebellion or deciding to stay at Hogwarts for the battle. It didn't have to be Malfoy or anything, but at least one token Slytherin, just to show that because you're ambitious and cunning at 11 doesn't mean you'll be evil all your life, would have been nice. Because otherwise it seems that being a Slytherin marks you for evil from the start and surely it'd be daft for a school to sort one fourth of its students into "road to evil".
I don't like fics going all whiny whine about Slytherins being poor misunderstood creatures, but Rowling's depiction of them does not completely satisfy me either.
To be ambitious and cunning does not mean to be evil unless you exercise your cunning in evil ways, or else fathers of our nation like Washington, de Gaulle or Cavour would have to count as villains. Of course, some such people definitely are villainous - Vittorio Emanuele II, Bismarck and Richelieu come to mind. But another question I had was about JKR's neurotic fear and hatred of politics and administration, and her replacement of patriotism with provinciality. I suspect this has to do with her downgrading of "ambition". Indeed, in Slytherin House as she depicts it, ambition seems to have morphed into its very reverse - conformity, bootlicking and a complete lack of individuality. This may, of course, be the shape that ambition takes in a society dominated by various immovable bureaucracies, but it is a mean and diminished version of what ambition really means. I hope you are ambitious in your goals, and I certainly am in mine. That is nothing to be ashamed of.
To be fair, there are several scenes in which the Slytherins are presented - in closing banquets and the like - as a whole house, and in every one of these, except for the final one (the gathering of the houses as the Battle of Hogwarts is about to take place), Draco Malfoy and his followers are shown to be a minority among the Slytherins. It is only "some" of the Slytherins, for instance, who refuse to drink to Cedric's memory and Harry's courage at the end of Goblet of Fire. And it is possible to say that the Slytherins were simply overcome by events - by Pansy Parkinson's contemptible display, Minerva McGonagall's burst of anger, everyone else's immediate condemnation; that they allowed themselves to be shepherded out of the building; and that then many of them came back along with their Housemaster and the people of Hogsmeade, in the rescuing force that drove the Death Eaters into the building. This is a possible reading, and I used to rely on it a lot. But the thing is, JKR has not supported it - to the best of my knowledge - and so the situation is that, to the best of our knowledge, only three Slytherins - Snape, Regulus and Slughorn - have in fact taken the side of the light in earnest, with three more - the Malfoys - breaking away from Voldemort when his dislike for them became obvious, without for that reason doing anything to help the Light. Not, as things stand, a tidy budget.
Incidentally, I would disagree that it was "only" love for Lily that made Snape abandon the dark. Lily was rather the embodyment of everything that held him away from becoming a Carrow or a Malfoy; and JKR shows Dumbledore's judgment of him shifting from contempt to complete trust and even dependency. When Dumbledore thought, as you do, that Snape had only broken with Voldemort because of Lily, he treated him with abruptness and contempt; after a few years getting to know him, he had every confidence that, whatever happened, Snape would not abandon the right side. This is about more than one beautiful redhead.
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Re: Eh-hem.....
Date: 2008-08-25 07:02 am (UTC)But having none of the Slytherin currently at Hogwarts join the side of Light? I mean precisely because they're only eleven when they're sorted, and also because they represent after all a full quarter of the school, you would expect that at least some of them (even just one) would, by the time they're 15, 16, 17, start thinking a little independently, especially once it has become clear lives were at stake.
"Sure, a handful will actually choose otherwise: but most won't even realise that there *is* a choice."
I totally agree with that, I think that's a realistic view: the majority follows and a handful acts differently. Except that in Canon, among the students of Harry's generation, there is not a single Slytherin joining the rebellion or deciding to stay at Hogwarts for the battle.
It didn't have to be Malfoy or anything, but at least one token Slytherin, just to show that because you're ambitious and cunning at 11 doesn't mean you'll be evil all your life, would have been nice.
Because otherwise it seems that being a Slytherin marks you for evil from the start and surely it'd be daft for a school to sort one fourth of its students into "road to evil".
I don't like fics going all whiny whine about Slytherins being poor misunderstood creatures, but Rowling's depiction of them does not completely satisfy me either.
Re: Eh-hem.....
Date: 2008-08-25 08:01 am (UTC)To be fair, there are several scenes in which the Slytherins are presented - in closing banquets and the like - as a whole house, and in every one of these, except for the final one (the gathering of the houses as the Battle of Hogwarts is about to take place), Draco Malfoy and his followers are shown to be a minority among the Slytherins. It is only "some" of the Slytherins, for instance, who refuse to drink to Cedric's memory and Harry's courage at the end of Goblet of Fire. And it is possible to say that the Slytherins were simply overcome by events - by Pansy Parkinson's contemptible display, Minerva McGonagall's burst of anger, everyone else's immediate condemnation; that they allowed themselves to be shepherded out of the building; and that then many of them came back along with their Housemaster and the people of Hogsmeade, in the rescuing force that drove the Death Eaters into the building. This is a possible reading, and I used to rely on it a lot. But the thing is, JKR has not supported it - to the best of my knowledge - and so the situation is that, to the best of our knowledge, only three Slytherins - Snape, Regulus and Slughorn - have in fact taken the side of the light in earnest, with three more - the Malfoys - breaking away from Voldemort when his dislike for them became obvious, without for that reason doing anything to help the Light. Not, as things stand, a tidy budget.
Incidentally, I would disagree that it was "only" love for Lily that made Snape abandon the dark. Lily was rather the embodyment of everything that held him away from becoming a Carrow or a Malfoy; and JKR shows Dumbledore's judgment of him shifting from contempt to complete trust and even dependency. When Dumbledore thought, as you do, that Snape had only broken with Voldemort because of Lily, he treated him with abruptness and contempt; after a few years getting to know him, he had every confidence that, whatever happened, Snape would not abandon the right side. This is about more than one beautiful redhead.